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    Chris Do Immigrant Journey Interview w/ Arjun Dhingra

    Chris Do unpacks his immigrant story, reframing hardship as a gift and revealing how letting go of attachment is key to growth.

    Chris Do

    Chris Do

    Founder, The Futur™ · October 22, 2024

    The Immigrant’s Burden, The Founder’s Gift

    There is the person you believe you can become. Then there is the person the world expects you to be. The space between those two identities is a battlefield of friction and adversity.

    For the children of immigrants, this battlefield is often their childhood home. There are expectations. There are duties. There is a narrow definition of success carved out by parents who sacrificed everything for a foothold in a new world.

    In a conversation with entrepreneur Arjun Dhingra, The Futur’s founder Chris Do reflects on this shared experience. “There's a certain expectation that we turn out a certain way,” Do begins. “And when we kind of buck that trend, maybe there's some adversity and a lot of friction that comes with that.”

    For Do, this wasn’t just a cultural pressure. It was a visceral, inherited trauma.

    “I'm a first generation immigrant,” he explains. “I wasn't born here. I don't know about you. So I'm still figuring out my way, my own identity.”

    When a family flees a country due to civil war and the shadow of communism, the act of starting over is not a clean slate. It is a wound carried across oceans. “I think there are certain traumas that are just inherited in the body that I don't learn about until much later,” Do says. “I can't imagine what it's like to now drop everything, your identity, your language, your culture, and start over somewhere else where everything is stacked against you.”

    That fear, held in the bodies of his parents, manifested as a rigid set of expectations for their children. The stereotype of the “tiger mom” and the intense academic pressure placed on Asian children is not a simple caricature. It is a survival mechanism.

    • An A grade is not excellent. It is average.
    • A B grade is barely acceptable.
    • A C grade means you might as well not come home.

    The reward for achievement was not praise. It was the absence of punishment. Do recalls the injustice he felt as a child, watching his Caucasian friends get new BMX bikes for C’s while his A’s earned him nothing but a brief reprieve. “Life is so unfair,” he thought then.

    Yet, looking back, this hardship was not a burden. It was a gift.

    Do points to a question posed by pastor and author Irwin McManus: are we truly capable of change? The answer is yes, but with a critical condition. “All of us are capable of change when our survival is dependent on it,” Do clarifies. Growing up surrounded by the echoes of war and the pressures of a refugee existence forces adaptation.

    Hardship becomes a training ground for resilience. You learn to survive out of pure necessity. The skills developed in that environment, the mental fortitude and adaptability, do not disappear. They carry into adulthood. “As you progress in life, it seems like nothing is ever as bad as it used to be,” Do explains.

    The baseline for “normal” is recalibrated. What others see as a crisis, you see as just another problem to solve. This mindset is a direct inheritance of a difficult past.

    The Prison of Attachment

    The human paradox is that we despise our problems, yet we are more afraid of the unknown solutions that could free us. We prefer the devil we know.

    This preference is rooted in one of the most powerful forces holding us back: attachment. We become attached to our identity, our stories, and even our pain. This attachment, Do argues, is what keeps individuals and businesses stuck and rigid, incapable of evolution. The principle is as ancient as Buddhist philosophy and as modern as the latest failed startup.

    “We become really attached to these things that I think define us,” Do says. “And we carry it with us like a very heavy burden.”

    Consider the person who was bullied as a child. That identity, “the one who gets picked on,” provided a protective shield for a time. But years later, as a successful captain of industry or a respected community leader, they still carry it. A minor slight or an offhand comment triggers the old wound. “Is that are you sliding me right now?” they think. “It's like nobody's picking a fight with you anymore. That was in the past.”

    We are often responding not to the present moment, but to ghosts. A business mentor once taught Do a powerful lesson: we are responding to things that are not here right now. Your spouse or child says something innocent, and you react with the full force of a past betrayal or a forgotten argument. The response is disproportionate because the trigger isn't the present words, but a memory you refuse to let go of.

    This dynamic plays out constantly in the entrepreneurial and creative worlds. People cling to:

    • An outdated business model: It worked once, so they refuse to see that the market has moved on.
    • A specific creative style: It defined their early success, so they cannot evolve, even as their style becomes irrelevant. This is a point Do explores in depth when discussing the difference between a personal brand and a business brand.
    • A narrative of struggle: Their early hardships became their identity, and they don't know who they are without them.

    To evolve, you must be willing to let go. Bruce Lee’s philosophy to “be like water” is not just a martial arts concept; it is a business and life strategy. Water is fluid, adaptable, and formless. Rigidity is death.

    “Your body and your mind, your spirit and your soul can only hold so much,” Do explains. “In order for you to be able to receive new things, new gifts, you have to be able to unburden yourself.”

    Progress requires creating a void. You cannot pick up something new if your hands are already full. The act of letting go is not an admission of failure. It is the prerequisite for growth.

    The Myth of Talent and The Invisible Work

    “You’re so talented.”

    It sounds like a compliment. It is intended as a compliment. But for anyone who has achieved a high level of mastery in their craft, it is one of the most frustrating things to hear.

    The idea of innate talent is a comforting illusion. It suggests that success is a matter of genetic lottery, something you are either born with or not. This illusion serves a specific purpose: it lets everyone else off the hook.

    “People will say something like, ‘Oh, that's easy for you because you have all that talent,’” Do says. “No. You are kind of dismissing everything that I did to get here.”

    To attribute Do’s ability to speak on stage, to build businesses, or to create influential content to “talent” is to ignore the reality of his past. It ignores the boy who felt like an outsider, who got into fights, who had to overcome deep-seated introversion and the fear of being attacked for not fitting in.

    The same applies to any high performer. When Dhingra, a two-time martial arts world champion, hears he is “gifted,” it dismisses every grueling minute of training. It ignores the wisdom in Muhammad Ali’s famous declaration: “I hated every minute of training, but I said, ‘Don’t quit. Suffer now and live the rest of your life as a champion.’”

    What people call talent is actually the visible result of thousands of hours of **invisible work**. It is the work you do when no one is watching. It is the practice, the failure, the study, the self-doubt, and the endless refinement that happens behind the curtain. The polished performance is merely the tip of the iceberg. To focus only on the tip is to fundamentally misunderstand the nature of achievement.

    The “talent” excuse is a self-preservation mechanism. “You say that not because you're complimenting me,” Do argues. “You say that because you give yourself an out.”

    By framing a successful person’s achievements as the product of some magical, unearned gift, you create an excuse for your own inaction. The logic is simple and seductive:

    • If they are talented and I am not, then I am not expected to achieve what they have.
    • If they had a supportive family or came from money, it explains their success and my lack thereof.
    • If their success is easy for them, my struggle is justified.

    It’s a narrative designed to relieve personal accountability. What people see as a gift is actually a debt paid in full through discipline and persistence. This is a crucial distinction for anyone trying to make a living doing what they love.

    The work is never done. As Bruce Lee is often quoted, “Human beings are all merely works of progress who mistakenly think from time to time that they are done.” Embracing this philosophy means rejecting the static idea of talent and committing to the dynamic process of continual, invisible work.

    The Antidote to Victimhood: Radical Ownership

    The myth of talent is a symptom of a much larger and more corrosive mindset: victimhood. It is the pervasive belief that your circumstances are the result of external forces, that someone or something else is always at fault.

    “When you achieve something, it's like, ‘It's my credit,’” Do observes. “But when things don't go your way, it's always somebody else's fault... The man is trying to hold you down.”

    This mentality is an anchor. It prevents individuals and businesses from making necessary changes because to accept that a different choice could lead to a different outcome would mean accepting responsibility for their current state. And for many, that responsibility is a burden they are unwilling to carry.

    Do recalls a story about the late actor Brian Dennehy, shared by the acclaimed Scottish actor Brian Cox. The lesson was simple and profound: as an adult, you reach a point where you must stop blaming everyone else for your life. Your parents, your teachers, society. The blame game has an expiration date. “At some point in your life as an adult you have to say, okay, I've done, I'm done blaming everybody and I can just own my own... I just got to own it.”

    There is no specific chronological age for this transition, but it must happen. Once you have agency, the ability to make your own money and live on your own, the responsibility shifts squarely to you.

    This is the essence of what Dhingra calls “LFG energy.” It is the conscious decision to adopt a posture of **radical ownership**. It is the understanding that you are both the cause of your problems and the source of your solutions.

    “The only person you have to blame for the things that you don't have or the things that you have is yourself,” Do states plainly.

    This mindset directly impacts how you interact with the world. Do sees this in the reactions to The Futur’s content. A video intended to be helpful and inspiring will sometimes trigger intensely negative reactions. People find reasons to be offended, claiming the advice doesn't apply to them because of their specific circumstances, their neurodivergence, or their personal story.

    Do has a theory about this reaction. “The reason why they respond so negatively towards it is because it's calling them out.” The content holds up a mirror, and they don't like the reflection. It challenges the victim narrative they have built to protect themselves. This is a difficult truth for many creators who wonder why their content doesn't connect.

    No one lives a perfect life. The defining factor is not the absence of challenges, but your ability to respond to them. Embracing radical ownership means seeing a clear vision for what you want and then taking the necessary steps to achieve it. It's a two-part process: clarity of vision, followed by deliberate action.

    As Do notes, it’s a theme echoed by many successful people. “Do less but better.” This principle, popularized by legendary designer Dieter Rams, is the antithesis of the scattered, reactive approach of the victim. Instead of trying to do everything and blaming external forces for poor results, you focus your energy on a few key actions that you own completely. This focus is the first step out of the victim quicksand.

    The Process Is the Prize

    What is the goal of your work? Is it the award, the title, the revenue target?

    For many, the destination is the sole motivation. They endure the process only for the promise of the prize at the end. But there is a fundamental flaw in this approach. Those who are in it for the destination are consistently out-performed by those who fall in love with the journey.

    Do uses his own career as a primary example. His company has won over three dozen awards, including a prestigious Emmy. These accolades, however, were never the goal. They were a byproduct.

    “The people who love the process of the journey more than the destination wind up going farther and outperforming the people who are in it for the destination,” he says. The philosophy is simple: **process over destination**.

    Do’s goal was never to win an Emmy. The goal was to do work that inspired his team, challenged their assumptions, and delighted their clients. “The winning of the award was not the intention of the work,” he insists. “We just did the work because we love the work and we love the clients who trust us with their brands.”

    When you are obsessed with the process, the external validation becomes secondary. If you win the world championship, as Dhingra did, it is a marker of your commitment, not the sole reason for it. If you don't win, your sense of self is not destroyed, because your identity is tied to the discipline and the craft, not the trophy. This is a core lesson in building a sustainable brand and career.

    A strange thing happens after you win, Do realized. “It means more to other people than it does to me.”

    Awards, degrees, and titles are forms of social proof. They are shortcuts people use to size you up and categorize you. In a world where traditional markers of worth like family name or university degrees are fading, new ones have taken their place. Social media following, engagement, the energy you project. These have become the currency of credibility.

    But even these can be manipulated. Anyone can put “Stanford” on their LinkedIn profile after dropping out in the first semester. Anyone can buy a million followers. The proof is in the engagement, the substance, the actual work.

    The person who is focused on the process is not concerned with faking these metrics. They are busy with the work itself. The external accolades are side effects, not objectives.

    This is the key to longevity and resilience. If your entire identity is wrapped up in winning, you are fragile. A single loss can break you. But if your identity is wrapped up in the commitment to the craft, to the daily practice, you are antifragile. Every challenge, win or lose, makes you stronger because it's another day spent practicing the thing you love.

    The New Battlefield: Education in the Age of AI

    The principles of resilience, adaptability, and ownership are not abstract theories. They are being tested in real-time, right now, in Do’s own business.

    “I believe the education space is changing quite rapidly,” he says, his tone shifting to one of immediate concern. “This is still very fresh.”

    The Futur, an education company, is facing a perfect storm. The business is down a substantial amount in revenue from the previous year, and Do identifies two primary forces driving this disruption. One is market saturation; the other is technological revolution.

    First, the market is flooded. “Everybody is an expert at everything,” Do laments. “Everybody is a life coach. 14-year-old life coaches.” The online space is saturated with marketers who have mastered the psychological levers of persuasion: the squeeze funnels, the high-pressure tactics, the promises of quick results with no work. This has led to a burnt-out, jaded market. Consumers have become cynical and skeptical, assuming everything is a scam.

    Second, and more profoundly, is the **commodification of information**, accelerated by artificial intelligence.

    “If AI for like 10 bucks a month can answer most of your questions to give you a tailored answer, why would somebody buy a $200 program, a $500 program, or a $5,000 program?” Do asks. It is a question that cuts to the core of his business model. The era of selling pure information products may be coming to an end. The value is shifting.

    This is not a future problem. It is a present-day crisis. Do describes it as being T-boned while driving a bus he thought he was steering expertly. He is now actively working to solve this existential threat to his company.

    The future, he speculates, lies not in information, but in application and human connection:

    • In-person experiences
    • One-on-one mentorship
    • Accountability groups
    • Peer communities

    These are things AI cannot replicate. These are where the new value will be created. He admits, “I don't have an answer yet. We're trying lots of things.” The instability and chaos this creates within his team is palpable, but his message to them is a reflection of the very principles he espouses: do your best every day, and we will get through this. It is a direct test of the adaptability he learned as a child.

    He is not in love with the way things are done. He is willing to pivot, to change, to let go of the model that brought him success because he understands that attachment leads to irrelevance. He is living the mantra of being like water, adapting to the shape of the new container the market provides. It is a powerful, vulnerable look at an entrepreneur navigating a seismic shift, a challenge he explores when he asks, “Will your future life coach be human?”

    The Constant Improver’s Paradox

    There is a personal cost to this relentless drive.

    Do’s therapist once labeled him a **constant improver**. It is part of his DNA. He is hardwired to believe that everything can be better, that the work is never finished. This is the engine of his success.

    It is also the source of a deep, personal struggle.

    “That's fine if you're by yourself,” he admits. “But it does take a toll on everybody who's around me.”

    The unintended consequence of moving so fast is that it can make those around you feel slow, lazy, or unworthy. His passion, his pursuit of what he believes to be his highest purpose, creates a wake that impacts his family. His wife and two sons, now young adults, have to carry the burden of his drive.

    “They didn't sign up for this,” he says with a raw honesty. “So I kind of have to figure that out.”

    This is the final, and perhaps most difficult, battlefield. The same immigrant drive that demanded he succeed, the same constant improvement that built his businesses, now creates a strain on the relationships that matter most. The very qualities that allowed him to overcome the expectations of his parents now create a new set of expectations for his own family.

    He has no easy answer. It is a problem he is still working through, a pivot he has yet to master.

    But the willingness to face it, to own it, and to speak about it openly is the ultimate expression of his philosophy. It is the practice of letting go of the perfect image of a leader and embracing the messy reality of a work in progress.

    The work is never done.

    AI for like 10 bucks a month can answer most of your questions to give you a tailored answer why would somebody buy a $200 program a $500 program or a $5,000 program I believe the education space is changing everyone is a life coach 14y old life coaches the Market's exhausted they're burnt out and they've become very jaded as to everything sucks let's just put it out there Chris I appreciate you brother taking some time to be on the show I've been a huge admirer The more I've gotten to spend time with you I just really respect who you are as entrepreneur and thought leader but also a human being thank you so much so thank you brother I feel that you and I have maybe a lot more in common than people might think if they look at the two of us in that if I talk about the concept of potential and expectations there's potential in all of us right and there's also potential in a brand in a person to perform whatever it might be we also have expectations or I should say what we believe our potential is internally but then on the external there's these other expectations of us about what they feel and what they think we should become or what we should do if I'm not wrong you being the children of immigrants and me being a child of immigrants there's a certain expectation that we turn out a certain way and when we kind of buck that Trend maybe there's some adversity and a lot of friction that comes with that for sure I experienced that yeah did you experience that where you've ended up now but this maybe wasn't necessarily what your parents or other people close to you were kind of expecting of you or thinking how I turn out yeah absolutely I'm a first generation immigrant so I wasn't born here I don't know about you so I'm still figuring out my way my own identity and when you flee a country due to war Civil War and you flee communism and you start over I think there are certain traumas that are just inherited in the body that I don't learn about until much later after talking to a therapist that my parents feel for sure I can't imagine what it's like to now drop everything your identity your language your culture and start over somewhere else where everything is stacked against you and so that's held into like their bodies as by parents but they shielded us from it but there are little behaviors that once you look back on in your life you see happen all the time and The Stereotype of like tiger mom high expectations of Asian children to do well in school it's like a given the if you get an A that's called average you need to get like an A plus those things you feel and and the way I can explain it is I remember very clearly the fear of God was put in me while going to school that if you don't get an A you're not doing well if you get a B it's acceptable but if you get a see don't even bother coming home and I remember like talking to my friends who are Caucasians who grew up here multigenerational they're like I got to see I'm getting a new BMX bike I'm like life is so unfair here I am getting A's a minuses and it's not not something that's you get praise thrown upon you there's no reward it's just lack of punishment is all that is so definitely I think there's a lot that we probably share and I know I know that um this this goes across like any type of Asian right we we definitely feel this yeah I mean you're still evolving right as a human being I know that's big for you is constant growth and evolvement much like Brands right they never stay the same they continue to evolve but in where you're at here in life and in looking back and obviously there's so much there in your story right and the country you fled and how you came here and then reframing this identity of yourself there's a lot of lessons or strategies or internal protocols that you probably developed along the way in reflecting on that as to how you battle through adversity how you bounce back because you've been through very unusual hardship and turmoil that most children maybe have never encountered or couldn't even begin to Fathom do you find that in your everyday life Chris in struggles or when you feel like maybe things are difficult or very challenging that you recall on those moments or is it just something inherent now that just happens like in terms of a strategy for a way out I really like that question we were just talking to irn mcmanis earlier and he was he's asked this question a lot I just want to reflect and share on that the question he asked is are we capable of change are all of us capable because all of us are capable of change when it's when it's uh our survival is dependent on it and so when you grow up with war or as a refugee and all the hardships that you have in the moment it doesn't feel like it's a gift but it actually is a gift because you learn to adapt to survive out of necessity and so the those those skills those gifts that was given as a child carry into adulthood because if you're living in a place that's very challenging mentally physically or economically you you learn to adapt and you learn to make do so that it becomes that's the normal that's the Baseline so as you progress in life it seems like nothing is ever as bad as it used to be so don't have that mindset anymore problems come to us and I think it's one of these things that I think it's a Buddhist idea where we should not try to escape or run away from pain or challenge because living the existence is painful and and once we Embrace that and not try to avoid our problems I think we'll become much more happy and at peace with ourselves and so I just accept everything good or bad it's really hot outside but that's just the way it is and it's our thinking of it the story that we tell ourselves that we frame it as good or bad and so luckily I think once I'm in my early to mid 20s I've developed a different mindset around this I'm in control of my destiny my fate how hard I work what where want to go to school I'm good with all the challenges at this point it's just it's work it's not a horrible work it's Joy it's not like uh exuberant uh euphoric Joy it's just I try and re in the Motions to try to be as stoic as possible if Brands humans we all evolve right you coming from the marketing world and where you spend so much time and energy and guiding people and understanding that there needs to be an absence of rigidity like things continually evolve like it's a fluid space even as human beings do you feel that with entrepreneurs or humans that you interact with that this is perhaps the one thing that maybe holds them back or holds back a brand or holds back a business or a company from continuing to forge forward which is being stuck and rigid as opposed to remaining fluid right being like water as Bruce Lee would say I think what makes this stuck is attachment we don't like problems but we we are more afraid of change and unknown than we are with our problems so when there's a better solution because it's unknown it's unpr predictable there's no guarantees it's going to work out we'll stick with the devil that we know and we become really attached to these things that I think Define us and this identity and we carry it with us like and it's a very heavy burden to continue to carry it so for example if you grew up if you looked and sounded a certain way somebody might be picking on you and then you've just have that thing even though it didn't serve you it it protected you for a little bit but you still carry that I'm going to be picked on for the rest of my life and you can be a captain of industry you could be city council person or chairman or chairperson of the board and you still like oh is that are you sliding me right now it's like nobody's picking up fight with you anymore that was in the past something I learned from my business Mentor was that often times we are responding to things that are not here right now so if your wife your husband your children say something to you you're recalling a memory from the past and it's like not even serving you anymore but you hold on to it so tightly and I see this in entrepreneurs and creative people all the time and until we let go of that can we take something else and if you think about it it's like your body and your mind your spirit and your soul Can Only Hold so much and in order for you to be able to receive new things new gifts for you you have to be able to like unburden yourself encumber unencumber yourself and get rid of the weight so that you can actually have the strength to carry something else it's very deep man the one thing I want to ask too which generally ask more towards the end but I just want to ask is given what I had shared with you earlier about the essence of lfg and like what I have in this community what does lfg energy mean to you there's no right or wrong answer but you as an entrepreneur and as a thought leader and someone who's very resilient and you embody this in so many ways what does lfg energy mean to you if you had to Define it or say anything of it yeah I think it just means that anything is possible and you can achieve anything and so the only person you have to blame for the things that you don't have or the things that you have is yourself blame goes both ways when you achieve something it's like it's my credit and that I should receive the accolades but when things don't go your way it's always somebody else's fault and and somebody didn't open the door for you the the man is trying to hold you down it's like it's all you and you can achieve as much as you want in your life you just have to be willing to see it and then to work towards it those two process like you have to see the goal clearly and once you have Clarity in the vision then you can actually take steps towards it I I think it's been a theme that we heard all morning from Neil and other speakers like Rory it's like we got to just like focus in on the thing that we want because if we if we broaden our Focus there's too many things that are coming at us and we don't know what to do we try to do all of them but not very well there's a phrase I forget who who I should be able to cite this quote but maybe will come to me later it's like do less but better I think everybody's trying to do more but doing more means you you're you're not doing as good of a job so if you could just do less but better I think everything works out there's that there's a Bruce Lee quote that I always come back to as a martial artist right and he's the uh he's the icon y the guru I should say human beings are all merely works of progress who mistakenly think from time to time that they are done right and the work is never done so a lot of what you said there in involvement and growth ties back to that it made me think think of it but I know you embody this and the businesses that you help the brands that you help the people that you associate with they have to embody this also because otherwise they'll be stuck and they'll remain rigid another thing you touched on and that last answer in terms of blame right is there's an association with like victim mentality which is really big sad in society it's prevalent I should say it's not big in a good way it's just prevalent but it ALS it holds people back as individuals do you also see that with businesses Brands um campaigns that rather than choosing to make the shift that there's a lot of people that choose to actually blame the external blame the market blame the response as opposed to fine tuning this message is that the easier way I think so because to accept that the world could be different if you chose different paths would mean that now I'm responsible for the things I don't have or the the relationships or whatever it is that you want to achieve in your life and I think it's the reason why sometimes our content I think is relatively innocent not all of it some of it is out there and I accept those parts but then people have such strong negative reactions like I could not in a million years see why this would be negative and then they're finding this one thing later on I think I've come to theorize that the reason why they respond so negatively towards it is because it's calling them out I don't live in that space in that world and that mindset I don't frame things that way so I could never see like why won't everybody want this and then there's some people who are like very easy for you to say because you have x y and Zed and then they're like you're not considering neurode divergent or my own personal story or whatever it's like look let's just put it out there no one lives a perfect life even perfect people don't live perfect lives and they make do with what they have and your ability to respond to challenges to to the things that scare you determine what kind of life you're going to have there you are let's take a quick break for something really exciting this video is brought to you by us the future future accelerator is all the best parts of coursework community and coaching all brought together for a single purpose to help you make a living doing what you love the accelerator membership includes a curriculum road map with over 100 video lessons and resources a supportive community and weekly coaching calls to give you support when you need it most also get access to personalized feedback on your assignments accelerator is specifically designed for creatives by creatives so if you're ready to build a magnetic portfolio learn how to bring in leads consistently and reliably run a profitable healthy happy creative business we can help click the link in the description below or head to the future.com accelerator see you there okay back to you Chris so an amazing trait that people may or may not know about you but I do is that you're an Emmy awward winner and that doesn't happen by accident and I know this as an athlete that competed and won two World Championships you having received an Emmy this takes a lot of discipline and structure and real commitment to get there but then getting there is one thing and it's not nothing to dismiss or diminish but staying there at that level maybe if you don't necessarily win the Emmy year in and year out or if I wasn't winning a world championship year in and year out but a certain standard is a really really challenging thing to make maintain how do you do it how do you stay on top how do you not let yourself get either lazy or lethargic in certain ways or complacent you know I think and and your your story may be a little bit different but there's this idea that really um I gravitate towards which is the people who love the process of the journey more than the destination wind up going farther further and outperforming the people who are in it for the destination I imagine in in the world of martial arts you're doing it for lots of different reasons the martial arts part the philosophical part the uh mindbody connection and the winning the championship is just a marker of your commitment to it not because you pursued it because the only reason why you want to do that is the World to Win CH world championship and if you don't then then your whole self is destroyed right so for me my my goal is to do work that inspires me and my team and that challenges what we think can be done given the budgets that we have and to delight and surprise our clients and every once in a while you receive some Accolade for that so the the winning of the award was not the intention of the work we just did the work cuz we love the work and we love the clients who trust us with their their brands their properties and for us to do the right thing and then your your team says maybe we should submit it for something so it is in a weird way for us kind of happen stance like I wasn't pursuing Awards especially towards the latter part of my career it didn't matter to me maybe when I was younger I was thinking I wonder if we can win that award as a game we play that and then we win one and a different one and so we've won a lot of awards probably over three dozen awards for different things and we're just moving around so it's like it and you know the thing that I realized after winning it it means more to other people than it does to me it really does is that something yeah it's kind of wild right so people need a short hand to sum you up and we live in a day and age now where your social proof your social clout is more important than what the the traditional models were like for example uh what family did you grow up in you know or what school did you graduate from what degrees do you hold and where have you worked before those are the traditional measures of one's worth but now I don't know and we we talk about it maybe it's kind of like myopic or self-centered but these days it's like when you look at somebody you're like how big is our following what's engagement like who are they attracting what kind of energy are they putting out there no one even cares if you went to whatever at school right they didn't even check and because we know it's very hard to verify that unless you're the school itself and the case and point here is that um I I I met people I looked them up on LinkedIn they're like oh Stanford and then later on I talked to them it's like you dropped out after one semester yeah you put that out there because you know what it's doing so that part can be faked it can be manipulated but and and social following can be as well but it's a little bit harder than we could tell usually right you have a million followers but four people liked your post so that's like 966 bot accounts I think 966 th000 so it's that kind of stuff it is yeah and I think also to your point like the people being short-handed with this or zero sum with you either won or lost or you went to this school or you didn't go to this school and everything in the middle which we as the people who were in the trench is really value in that process and that commitment to struggling right like Muhammad Ali said if you suffer as you train you'll celebrate the rest of your life as a champion like he said training was like insufferable it was terrible absolutely terrible but people just don't necessarily understand all that work that goes into the middle like I would hate it and I don't know if this speaks to you not hate it's a stronger but it's kind of like uh it would it would irk me a bit when someone say you're so talented you seem so gifted and I'm saying I appreciate where that may be coming from and I could say that to you Chris as an artist as a creative you're so gifted and you might say back to me look I'm not it's not that I'm talented or gifted to say that would diminish all the work that I've put into this craft to get up to this point my continual evolvement you're seeing this but you've missed all of this which is what I celebrate and where I choose to stay right so you ident with that 100% I mean like we could be brothers on this one right cuz people will say something like oh that's easy for you cuz you have all that Talent no you are U kind of dismissing everything that I did to get here I've come from from a place where i' I felt like an outsider I'm an introvert and I've gotten into fights with people I don't even know because for whatever reason I didn't fit their image of what was acceptable and so they they try to bully me they try to do all kinds of things and I had to go through that adversity and so now when I'm when I have the privilege to be on stage and speak and share my truth and not be afraid that some bigger kid is going to punch me from behind my head then like oh it's so easy for you like no there was a lot of inner work you and I are doing how we show up when no one's watching The Invisible work as people often refer to it is and now you can quickly summarize it like that and the reason why you hate potentially or why it aggravates me is you say that not because you're complimenting me it sounds like you're complimenting you say that because you give yourself an out who like oh you must come from a certain kind of family that supported you or you come from money or you do they just say all kinds of weird things because it gets them off the hook it relieves their accountability and that's okay when you're like 14 17 but at some point in your life you have to own it um they were interviewing Brian Cox from uh the lead actor from succession do you remember Brian Cox yeah so he's a power amazing actor yeah just amazing in everything he touches and he was sharing something with Terry Gross and he says you know the the late great Brian dny the actor who passed recently in the storyline he says you know what you can blame everybody but at some point in your life as an adult you have to say okay I've done I'm done blaming everybody and I can just own my own S I just got to own it and now it's on me and I'm not saying that there is a chronological timeline when you have to say you have to own it but when you have agency and you can do your own things and you have ability to make money to live on your own at some point into that you kind of have to own it I think we touched on struggle you know as a youth in during those formative years is there anything in recent months weeks or just recent years where you've really battled through some adversity either professionally personally that you feel you were able to draw on those past experiences and that's what actually got you through you didn't feel alone in that moment I'll share two things with you I'm not through so this is still very fresh okay so we'll see how this works out professionally I believe the education space space is changing quite rapidly I think it's uh due to a number of different things number one everybody is an expert at everything everybody is a life coach 14-y old life coaches like okay and so the market is flooded with people who know how to excel at the marketing game The Squeeze funnel and the the the pushing all your levers the psychological manipulation that get people to buy and so the Market's exhausted they're burnt out and they've become very jaded as to everything sucks this is all a scam which I get unfortunately and what they do really well is they promise you quick results no work pay now and it's just all done for you and we know that it's a lie nothing worth having is easy if it's easy everybody to have it therefore it's not worth it and so there's a flood in the marketplace and then there is the commodification of information it's information is cheap and it's accelerated by the Advent of AI Gary was asking this question on stage about how many of using AI to search versus Google and a lot of people stood up I couldn't tell how 20 percentage but it was a lot more than I thought and so if AI for like 10 bucks a month can answer most of your questions to give you a tailored answer why would somebody buy a $200 program a $500 program or a $5,000 program so we're seeing potentially the beginning of the end for information products so people are going to want something different maybe in person one to one accountability peer group mentorship those kinds of things I could see that still working so we're an education company and this is like hitting us sideways like I'm driving the bus and I didn't know know and usually I'm pretty good at spotting these things pretty quick boom we're T-boned Ai and and the the race to the bottom for information so this is what we're trying to work out uh I mentioned before like we're down a million dollars in revenue from the previous year and it's something that we have to sort out or otherwise we're not the same company we are today which I'm okay with adapting but I'm trying to sort out this problem I don't have an answer yet we're trying lots of things and I hope by the next time we have this conversation I can tell you we successfully navigated we pivoted as we have done so many times before cuz I'm not in love with the anything the way we do things how we help people so I'm willing to try I know for my team that kind of instability feels like chaos it feels very uneasy and there's lots of fear and I try to quell people's fears like you know what do the best you can every single day and we're going to get through this the second part is a personal thing this is something I struggle with so I'm hardwired to work to continually uh to work on myself and to work on business so my my therapist told me many many years ago I'm a constant improver it's just part of my DNA so not saying that everything is wrong it's just like everything could be better and so I'm trying to do that all the time that means that like you said Works in progress Works in progress or never finish it's just I'm tired today so today's finished but tomorrow's another day to start again right and we know this that's fine if you're by yourself but it does take a toll on everybody who's around me for a number of different reasons the the one that's indirect cor and might be surprising to people is and and I I understand this I feel this that when you're around somebody who's moving so fast if you don't move fast it makes you feel slow lazy lethargic and not worthy and that's the unintentional consequence like I believe in this and there's many people have said it different ways but I believe that our highest purpose is to pursue our passion to do that and just to do that with expectation or attachment of outcome and that's what we should do and I'm doing that but unfortunately sometimes when you do that it has impacts like I I have two boys they're 20 and 18 and my wife they they kind of have to carry the burden with me and they didn't sign up for this so I kind of have to figure that out so it's creating definitely a strain on our relationships and how we have to navigate this moving forward to which I don't know I'm going to do this cuz I I I I love unconditionally I hope that I'm loved unconditionally back but sometimes there are conditions of course and we're trying to figure that out but I think everyone who knows you um does love you and I know this about you and what you embody which is an indomitable spirit so I have no doubt the professional and the personal challenges or adversity uh that you're enduring right now that when we do sit down and have this conversation again in the future it will be about the Triumph for the next chapter or how it finished in a beautiful way all positive nothing but good stuff so I appreciate you very much Chris thank you so much for spending the time with me man I wish you all the best and again Mad respect for you man thank you LG that's it
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    “The only person you have to blame is yourself.”

    — Chris Do

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